Summer Throwback: Sheila McCarthy

Mary Anne Ivison (Voiceover)  0:02  
The Women Of Ill Repute with your hosts, Wendy Mesley and Maureen Holloway.

Maureen Holloway  0:07  
So I have this this belief, this theory, this saying it's not entirely original, but I live by it.

Wendy Mesley  0:14  
Okay, so I should know this but what is it?

Maureen Holloway  0:17  
You sure that what what doesn't kill you makes you funny?

Wendy Mesley  0:23  
Ah, okay, so a little bit of a different lineup, but I don't know is that for everybody? 

Maureen Holloway  0:29  
If it was in then hospitals would be churning out comedians, right. They'd be doing stand up in the parking lot people would come home from war and do improv. So no, not for everybody.

Wendy Mesley  0:40  
Well, some people emerge from the hospital and do stand up, but I guess yeah, I guess largely, that's not the case. But but it's a coping mechanism, right?

Maureen Holloway  0:48  
Well, this is my point, if you follow that line of thinking, anxiety, which I have, can be a superpower. And if you tackle the subject of your anxiety or your fear, and you work with it, you turn it around, and you get down to the nitty gritty of it and then you share it, through writing or stand up, and people connect and laugh at it with you.

Wendy Mesley  1:10  
Yeah, that's way better than- 

Maureen Holloway  1:13  
As opposed to at you, although they don't laugh at you as much as you think they do, which is what I have found, or maybe they are laughing, I don't know, but then you've conquered it or at least you're controlling your anxiety.

Wendy Mesley  1:25  
A lot of people have come on the podcast have sort of dealt with this issue, which is I don't know we've seen that a lot. We've had Jessica Holmes. She's a comedian. She's tackled depression- very, very funny. Allison Door, she suffered from, suffers from depression, when she was addicted to a bunch of stuff, too. And Lauren Huff, I mean, she's, she was raised in a cult, and she thinks that's funny. Like everything is funny.

Maureen Holloway  1:25  
When she finds it, she finds the humor of being raised in a sex cult. But-

Wendy Mesley  1:55  
So maybe what doesn't kill you can make you funny, maybe yeah-

Maureen Holloway  1:59  
In our Substack, Wendy and I write for Substack under Women Of Ill Repute- 

Wendy Mesley  2:05  
Sign up here, sign up. 

Maureen Holloway  2:06  
Sign up here, or go or sign up there go to Substack and anyway, I digress. The stories that get the biggest response for me are the ones where I fall down, or the one where I the one where I got the fungus and in my nail and yeah.

Wendy Mesley  2:20  
So how is that? How's the fungus going?

Maureen Holloway  2:24  
I don't have I just have a damaged nail and now I have to get a note from my doctor if I want a manicure. But anyway, it's really stupid. 

Wendy Mesley  2:35  
Well, this week's guest she is she probably really like your fungus story. She she really embodies honesty, fearlessness, and she's she's very, very funny. Her name is Samantha Ruby. She is a hugely popular writer. If you're on YouTube, you might be able to see her sort of hanging in the bottom of the picture. Her books, they appear regularly on the New York Times bestseller list. She writes about everything and I mean everything. She writes about sex and feminism, and certain bodily functions. There's this insane dog that she got during the pandemic, she talks about that. And she's also a TV writer, she's written and produced episodes of and just like that, the reboot of Sex in the City.

Maureen Holloway  3:16  
Which was not apparently the dream gig that you might expect it to be, but it's all grist for the mill. Sam Ruby's latest book of essays is called 'Quietly Hostile'. Which I totally relate to and she's with us today listening patiently to talk about nail fungus. And don't, you don't like you don't like doing podcasts?,So we're very, very happy that you're doing this one.

Samantha Irby  3:45  
Oh, you know, I don't not like it. I don't like myself and my ability to answer questions off the cuff in a way that both makes sense to you. So podcasts are great. It's just, It's my own untrustworthy brain.

Wendy Mesley  4:08  
Well, we like you for your brain and and I think I read something saying that you also don't like being edited. So we just have to tell you that we don't edit anything. Unless, unless you say something really legally. Yeah so-

Samantha Irby  4:20  
I haven't had media training, but I've had enough. I can't believe you said that moment to be a pretty good like self regulator.

Maureen Holloway  4:30  
Yeah, but I mean, are you still now? I mean, it's a double edged sword because you're so forthcoming about, oh, I want to talk about your newest article. I think it's the latest one about it's okay to hate your body. We're gonna get there but do you think because that's refreshing, but do you think because you go there now people expect you to go there. It's a double edged sword.

Samantha Irby  4:54  
I don't think anybody has any expectations, expectations that I'd have to live up to but I think if I put out a book that had no gross stuff, no butt stuff, no nothing people would be like, who wrote this? You didn't write this? This isn't yours. I don't feel any pressure to but I know that if I did switch up my style, people would be like, oh, we miss the fart stuff.

Wendy Mesley  5:27  
I liked the fart jokes. It's the poo stuff I'm uncomfortable with with talking about poo.

Maureen Holloway  5:32  
Oh, wait a second. Where's the distinction here?

Samantha Irby  5:35  
That is not what I'm trying to change. You shouldn't be uncomfortable. Like, are you uncomfortable talking about blinking or breathing?

Wendy Mesley  5:45  
No, I'm a prude.

Maureen Holloway  5:46  
She is.

Samantha Irby  5:48  
I don't think that I think we we just live in a society that makes you feel bad or weird for this thing that you have to do all the time and then we-

Wendy Mesley  5:59  
Well I don't I never do that. 

Samantha Irby  6:01  
Oh, you don't? Oh, well, then I understand why you don't want to hear about it. Because this horrible thing happens to everybody else. But I think like, the more we sort of talk about it, and you know, then it starts to lift the stigma. Even if it's only among your, like family, or friends, or, like you don't have to, I'm not trying to change the world. I just want people who talk to me to know that. If I go to the bathroom, it might be 20 minutes and not to make a big deal. Go ahead and order the appetizers I will be back.

Maureen Holloway  6:39  
Well, I was I was gonna say I was raised by men. And that's not true, I was raised by women, but I have two grown sons and a husband and this kind of conversation. They have their own bathroom just for that reason and so you know, that's just the way it is. And but women aren't don't grant each other that freedom.

Samantha Irby  7:00  
No and it's so sad to me. 

Maureen Holloway  7:03  
It is. Like in a public washroom. I will flush the toilet when I'm making any audible noises because embarrassed to have anybody else hear me do what what other people, what I hear other people do.

Samantha Irby  7:18  
Yeah, I mean, it's, you know, I'm not a sociologist. I'm definitely not like smart enough to any me facts, but it is, it is a shame that you feel ashamed, doing a thing that truly, we all have to do. And maybe yours are like quick and don't stink to gray, but like, long stinky ones are equally acceptable, and you shouldn't feel bad doing that in in a toilet that was meant for your poop.

Wendy Mesley  7:59  
It's so funny, because we're in this like, anti shame era, it seems right now. Like everyone was saying, get rid of shame, like, just be proud. And, and Maureen and I we both had cancer and we both thought that was hilarious. Once we found that we're gonna live we just-

Maureen Holloway  8:13  
Well, there there were aspects. There were aspects of it and later, you know, I spoke about it, you know, I made it a topic when I was on the speech circuit, about, you know, the not the humorous side of it, but dealing with, you know, stuff with humor and going there. And you know, I remember saying I had I've had one breast replaced and then I could tell everybody's like, you don't know which one. The truth is, it's in the back for dancing, but I mean, yeah, it was it was very empowering. But I want to talk about you this. I think it's new to us, because I think it just came out last week your article on you don't have to like your body, your body, not your body, ones body, but yes, your body. Our bodies betray us, right, they get sick, they don't conform to the shape that we want. You suffer from Crohn's disease, our arches fall it's not even just just aging. Some of us are born in near perfect packages through just through luck and genes and others are born with a hell of a lot of challenges. And yet we're all supposed to love our bodies equally.

Samantha Irby  9:21  
I understand and respect the sentiment, but I do think it excludes people who struggle with their bodies for whatever reason. I think it sets a goal. That doesn't have to be a goal right? Like, if you come to terms with your body, and it's all of its whatever's, great, but if you can't, if you just can't get over its betrayal, I think that that's okay. And I think that there should be spaces for people to be like 'Oh, I feel terrible today, and I hate this body'. And like, it has to be okay. For you to say that without someone being like, what about the message you're sending to children or, you know, people, whenever you you sort of do something that's against the majority people will find a myriad number of ways to try to get you to take it back. And it's like, well, I'm not teaching how to hate your body. I'm just saying that I have a complicated relationship with mine. I just don't like anything that flattens, or there's no nuance allowed. I don't like that. I feel like for there to be a not to make a sex pawn. But for there to be a top there has to be a bottom, right? Like for if you love your body, there have to be people out there who hate there's, and both experiences are valid. I just don't like the kind of like, we all should be doing this. And it's like, well, what about the people who can't afford to do that? What about the people who can't change their circumstances? What about the people who don't have access? And I just hate any sort of like blanket statement, even if it's like a good fit, you know, like ostensibly loving your body should be a good, nice thing. But it's okay, If you don't, if you don't.

Wendy Mesley  11:31  
Thank God for your brain because you've got an amazing brain, your body might have let you down. But you're-

Samantha Irby  11:36  
Yeah, I said, if I could be like Krang from the Ninja Turtles, where I've just a brain inside a big pass monster. I mean, it's essentially now, but I'm forced to do human stuff and live like human life, I would be happy just being a brain in a jar. Unfortunately, unfortunately, being a person doesn't work like that.

Wendy Mesley  12:07  
So what are your tips? We in your book, you list a couple of tips when it how do you? How do you survive with just a big brain?

Samantha Irby  12:14  
I just think you have to get to whatever place in yourself where you can just keep going and understand when things aren't for you, or that you don't have to adhere to what people are saying. You know, if you don't ever want to wear shorts, don't wear um, and to you know, like, I dress in a way like I'm wearing all black and I'm I want sleeves and pants that like you know, you walk outside and people are like, what, it's 80 degrees, aren't you going to burn up in that, you know, like trying to change what makes me comfortable. And you just have to kind of block out. If you do anything different people will always remind you that what you're doing is different and just like stand in what's good for you. I don't like to feel my arms like touching other things. So I put sleeves on them and that's okay. Even if it's 90 degrees. There's just a lot of leg not being pressured to conform is the wrong word. But like marching to the beat of your own drummer and like drowning everyone else out.

Maureen Holloway  13:31  
There is a certain amount of irony I think listening to you and reading you that you were brought in, to write and ultimately produce part of and just like that, which is essentially a story of for perfect women aren't seemingly, you know, white cisgendered women in New York. I mean, they have their problems, but ultimately, they were blessed in so many ways. Tell us about that. How, why, why do you think you were brought in? How was the experience? I mean, it's there are all sorts of stories associated with this. But tell us a bit about that. 

Samantha Irby  14:02  
Well, I was a huge fan of the original series. I still am I think it came out when I was like 19 and I didn't have cable. So I waited for the VHS tapes to come out. This is a 1999 I would like go to Best Buy, buy a season and then my friend and I would just like sit and watch them. So I always loved the show. I've seen every episode multiple times. I got the job because Michael Patrick King who is the showrunner, creator, writer, executive producer, read my last book, 'Wow, No Thank You' and reached out to my agent and was like I have to have her work on this show. So my agent reaches out and is like 'Hey, Michael Patrick king wants to work with you'. And I was like, 'shut up', you know what I mean? I was like get like this is bullshit get out of here. And he was like, 'No for real'. And he forwarded me the email and was like, it's real. So we set up a Zoom and I talked to Michael, we hit it off, I mean, really, within seconds, like I was wearing this hideous shirt. And Michael was like, what is that shirt? And I was like, I know, I know. It's terrible. I I'm not meant to work on a show about fashion, but I got hired anyway. And the experience. I mean, I was like, there's no way they're gonna let me like, really get my claws into this show. Right? I thought I would punch up a few jokes, you know, like, bring some life and color to the writers room. But we started and they were like, oh, no, this is fully, this is fully yours to all your ideas. Let's get them out there. So the writers room is so funny. Like, It's great working on comedies, because you just do bits all day long to try to make the other people in the room laugh and in between the bits, It's like, should Charlotte do this? And it's, it was like a really, really great experience. Both times I worked on season one, and season two that comes out in a couple of days. It was like an incredible experience. If it's the only job I have going forward fine, because it's been like, amazing.

Maureen Holloway  16:39  
And you were shocked that some of the response from-

Samantha Irby  16:44  
Oh, that part? 

Maureen Holloway  16:46  
Yeah, that part where people believe they're real people.

Samantha Irby  16:50  
Yes, that part I was not prepared for. I get it going in. I didn't it wasn't a thing that I had thought about. And like, you never know what somebody really thinks on the internet, right? You don't even know if you're talking to a person. I mean, they were funny to me, like hilarious, like death threats, or somebody called me a murderer because Mr. Big died in the first episode. And I was just like-

Maureen Holloway  17:19  
Was that that, were you responsible for you that that was a collective idea?

Samantha Irby  17:24  
I mean, yes.

Maureen Holloway  17:26  
Was your idea.

Wendy Mesley  17:28  
Yeah because you hate him. So you probably offed him didn't you?

Samantha Irby  17:31  
I put the peloton to extra fast and it gave him a heart attack. But I wanted to say, and I think it's like, because, you know, I have a pretty big platform, and people can find me, right. And they can't find like, you know, whatever other person in the room. I don't get to make decisions like which character dies, but because they like can't reach Michael, it's like, well, let's tell Sam to kill herself because of it. I don't know him but this this is right here die, Sam we love Mr. Big. I wish that I could just like write out the hierarchy of like, if I have an idea, all of the filters it must go through before it gets to the screen. And it's like, I'm not I don't need to make those decisions. They pay me to write dumb jokes that they'll either include cut and that's it. I don't really know how to talk about parasocial relationships because I don't really know what they are I just hear people saying that, but clearly, people had parasocial relationships with these characters. And I underestimated or didn't estimate at all what they would feel about the show. I mean, maybe they just want the show to not exist, which is, you know, whatever, but like the people who actually watched it and got mad, I just didn't like what did you what did you want it to be? Like the postumous criticism is like, you know, oh, there were no people of color. This is New York, blah, blah, blah. They brought it back and it's like, well, we'll put people of color in it this time. Oh, but they didn't do it the right way. Or they didn't do and then it's like, okay, and then if you ask anyone, what would what would you have done? There's nothing right, there just like ugh, because no one ever like knows how they fix it. They just know how to complain about it. So this time around, I do not have Twitter anymore. I deleted it when first season came out and I've changed my Instagram settings so you can't message me so if people are mad, hopefully I won't hear about it.

Maureen Holloway  20:03  
They can get in touch with us. 

Samantha Irby  20:05  
Yes. 

Maureen Holloway  20:07  
Yeah, no problem.

Samantha Irby  20:08  
Yeah, you have my email you know, you know how to-

Maureen Holloway  20:12  
We'll be the guardians gate.

Samantha Irby  20:13  
But you know, I mean, the the hilarious thing about it is because I've only worked on small shows with like, small niche shows with dedicated viewers. So not people who are like, Tweeting, die bitch after an episode. But like, this was the first like, big thing that lots of people care about that I've worked on. I mean, I'll keep working on this but you know, they reboot Game of Thrones or something and they want to make it funny and they come to get me, I absolutely want that.

Maureen Holloway  20:55  
They wrecked it anyway, but that's, that's a whole other story.

Samantha Irby  20:58  
Okay, but like, okay, but let me say this, what would he and Carrie have done this the season to be interesting?

Wendy Mesley  21:08  
I was really struck by I mean, the whole city thing is fascinating and you did hate Mr. Big so we are going to hold you responsible for that and send your email to everybody now, so they can come through.

Maureen Holloway  21:19  
Now, if that was already done, that was done and it would end and I know I completely I was shocked. But I completely understood how this would sit and carry on to the next part of her life. She can't live happily ever after with Big.

Samantha Irby  21:32  
Yeah, it's like you want to see her day. You want that that date where she puked in the street. It's like, you want to see you want to see the coffee cups with nothing in them. That kills me when you see a person take a drink of a cup that has nothing in it. I'm like, they couldn't have put like, a couple of ounces of water in there just to make it look realistic.

Maureen Holloway  22:02  
To see why they wrecked it anyway. But that's that's a whole other story.

Samantha Irby  22:06  
No, the most proud, the most proud I am of season one was that scene where Carrie pukes in the street, it was like, you can hear the like, oh, you know that we all do it. I was like, give Sarah Jessica an Emmy. That is incredible.

Wendy Mesley  22:27  
That's my pet peeve though. You've written about how that's a pet peeve of yours that the vomiting scenes are never real. I scream at my TV set all the time, because they carry suitcases like there's nothing in them and that's my pet peeve. But Sex in the City you loved Carrie, Sarah Jessica Parker, whatever, my daughter who you know, is a lot younger, surprise, surprise than both of us all of us and even you.

Maureen Holloway  22:54  
Well, I hope so.  

Wendy Mesley  22:55  
Such a surprise.

Maureen Holloway  22:58  
I heard I had her when I was 11.

Wendy Mesley  23:01  
I bought her when she was fully grown. No, I didn't, but if she's the she thinks that Carrie is fake, and her whole sexual relationship is fake and, and she really liked the the Canadian girl and whatever, but I really loved the so we've had lots of debates about sex in the city and you know, it was formative for people who were a little bit older. And growing up when it was when it was still fresh as opposed to being wise and young like she is of course, but your second or your almost last chapter is about, like you've got stepkids and you don't tell them what to do. And you don't tell them what's funny, and you don't like so to me that's like, like I try and say oh, my daughter my says that this is this is cool. So therefore I'm cool, but you're just saying like give up. Don't even try.

Samantha Irby  23:47  
Well with stepkids. It's a it's different because like, what, I don't have a leg to stand on. Right? If I were to tell them what to do, they have two parents, their parents can be in charge of all their stuff. I will sit like, don't hold a knife like that, like I don't not talk to them, we have a great relationship. I just don't parent them. I never had any desire to be a parent to like, guide anyone's life choices. Like that's what I think of when I think of parenting because, you know, people will ask me about this a way that sort of like you're being mean to the children and it's like, first of all these children live in a nice house that I pay for and their lives are great, but like I don't look at things like we have a full refrigerator or the house is nice or the cleaning service was just here as part of parenting. That's that those are things I would like do for myself. I have to have a place to live so I guess you guys can live here too, but that active parenting the like what are you studying? Did you do your homework? I don't want to participate in that. Ever. They don't want it from me.

Wendy Mesley  25:11  
Do kids want it? Like? Should parents like you offer advice to adults basically, don't talk about weed. Don't talk about what's cool. Don't ever send them an email.

Samantha Irby  25:21  
Well, that's to protect you. I will just want to protect myself in this situation and other adults from being humiliated, trying to get validation from teams, but like, the actual parenting, like, of course, you should, of course, you should talk to them and ask them what's up. But I think being a try hard step parent is only going to get your feelings hurt. That is what I have learned in my, like, a nine years of or no, I think I've been with Kirten for 10 years. 10 years of knowing these kids is I am not going to get cool points from them so I don't try and it has made my life better because I don't feel rejected all the time. I kids are so like, casually, brutal. Like if you're watching something on TV, they will just get up and leave and you're like, what about the end? And they're like, oh, I don't care about this. Quietly devastating. Yeah, I just I don't want to I don't step on any mom or dad toes. I just, I treat them like almost like my friends, but they're like my freeloader friends who I've paid for every time-

Maureen Holloway  26:51  
That's that's what that's what grown children are. They're your freeloading friends. Yes so true. 

Mary Anne Ivison (Voiceover)  27:00  
The Women Of Ill Repute. 

Maureen Holloway  27:03  
Wendy do you want it? And I want to ask you, I love your list of recommendations. You know, flip flops and moisturizer and toilet paper and all these kind I love this. As opposed to the oh, you know, this is my $300 moisturizer and I can't live without my mink lined slippers. These are practical items. 

Samantha Irby  27:21  
Yeah, I saw one that had a $15,000 walk, like what the hell? And it's like, first of all, you could live without that, second, you have a phone in your hand like that has the time on it. Anything that. I mean? You may notice a theme if you read my work, anything that makes regular to poor people feel like shit for being regular, poor, having less, I don't like that. But I just so many things are so far out of reach for most of us already. I don't want to read like my favorite rapper has a watch that is worth more than my car. I want to know like, what brand of Q tips does he like? That's the thing I could actually go out and get and I can be like, Oh, Drake and I have the same cute dips.

Maureen Holloway  28:26  
Yeah, I love that actually.  

Samantha Irby  28:28  
You know, I hate that shit that's like, you know, regular people are reading it, you know, like the audience is, you know, people who make $30,000 a year. Don't say that your Rolls Royce is an essential I mean, say what you want, but I just don't like when it's like you know, my Maserati is the thing that I can't live without and maybe you can't but like talk about that

Wendy Mesley  28:56  
I did send my daughter your recommendations for moisturizer and she was like yeah, that's great, it's very expensive because it's $40

Samantha Irby  29:03  
That First Aid Beauty, First Aid Beauty Ultra Repair Cream is a miracle and none of my stuff is sponsored like nobody offers me sponsorships probably because I'm too gross and unreliable in the way I would market their product but that First Aid Beauty cream.

Wendy Mesley  29:23  
Well cool jokes are coming in I think so you know go for-

Samantha Irby  29:31  
Everything, there are things that I actually use that everyone could get if they want. 

Wendy Mesley  29:38  
And your purse. 

Samantha Irby  29:40  
Yeah, I got a lot of stuff. 

Wendy Mesley  29:43  
Your bag like there's all kinds I cuz you suffer from I don't know OCD, depression, colitis like you got like a few things a lot so in your purse you've got you don't leave the house unless you've got what?

Samantha Irby  29:55  
I don't leave the house without this very specific, oh my god, I cannot remember what it's called. It's the preparation H, in the silver tube. I don't know.

Maureen Holloway  30:08  
Yeah, never know.

Samantha Irby  30:09  
I had some ulcers down there and that stuff was a dream. 

Wendy Mesley  30:15  
Well, people in television they put Preparation H under their eyes to get rid of bags, apparently.

Samantha Irby  30:20  
I'm gonna try that as I have noticed in my bag, I have plenty of preparation H. I don't leave without, Motrin or you know, some sort of ibuprofen. I always have a book in my bag. I don't know the last time I've been like, bored in public and, like took the book out of my bag. Unless like my phone unless I accidentally ran over my phone with the car. But I'm so terrified of being alone with my own thoughts for more than 30 seconds that I must always have a distraction so usually a book. I like to have napkins. I like to have Flonase because you never know when a nasal irritant. 

Wendy Mesley  31:14  
That's a big bag. 

Samantha Irby  31:17  
Oh, I carry like a suitcase around. I like to have some air pods just in case I want to pretend to be on a call. If somebody's trying to talk to me you're like, oh, sorry, my accountant. I'm going to tax jail. Yeah, wallet of course. The here's a weird thing I want to ask you because I was just thinking about this this morning in the Starbucks drive thru. I have all of my cards in my wallet. That's not normal right? Like I should have just some at home.

Maureen Holloway  31:56  
No, you don't need to. Yeah, you can actually most and I only figured this out recently is you can you can get most of your cards on your phone. There are very few that you can't load. Yeah. 

Samantha Irby  32:10  
Right. Yeah. Okay. I was I do have a big wallet and like all my cards are in it and I was going through it this morning and I was like, if I lost this. I don't even know all the numbers. I'd have to call the-

Maureen Holloway  32:24  
No, you can put them you can load them all onto your phone. You're welcome. 

Samantha Irby  32:28  
Thank you. Don't lose your phone. Or then he makes sure you bring a charger, like that's what something I've started doing now as you bring the extra battery because your phone loses its charge right? 

Maureen Holloway  32:38  
Oh, you know, I you know I have one of those. 

I know you do. Sam, I don't want to let you go and Weny he doesn't want to let you go, we've got to ask you about your dog. How's your dog?

Samantha Irby  32:51  
Well, he sucks. I just dropped him off at his very expensive but worth it, daycare. He goes Monday, Wednesday and Friday. So he can run, run, run and then come home tired. He I mean, here's the thing. He's healthy. I mean, that's the one good thing about him, he's healthy. Everything that he is so naughty, he's so naughty. The other day, I walked in the bedroom, and he was trying to ride one of the cats. Like she was walking and he's like over her and I was like, what a nightmare animal to have in my home and he's a chihuahua mix. So he's gonna live for like 30 years and ruin the rest of my life.

Maureen Holloway  33:48  
No, but he will. He's got a little dog energy and he's healthy. 

Samantha Irby  33:55  
He's obsessed with Kirsten, he hates I could die in front of him and he'd be like, rip, but Kirsten, like she leaves to go get something out of the car and he panics and I just hate that he doesn't love me therefore, he is my mortal enemy for life. And luckily for me, he's a dog so I get to mostly be in charge of him, mostly. Except for when he's begging me for food or needs to be driven somewhere and I have to take him. But he's, I mean, he has added an energy to the house that we didn't have before and I'm gonna pretend to like that new energy, because I can't do anything.

Maureen Holloway  34:49  
I kind of sums up a lot of things.

Samantha Irby  34:53  
Yes, yeah, that is my whole thing. I'm just going to deal with it because I have no other choice.

Wendy Mesley  35:00  
We think you're funny. 

Maureen Holloway  35:01  
Well your dog may not love you, but we do. 

Samantha Irby  35:05  
I love you. This was great.

Maureen Holloway  35:07  
Sam, you're gonna be in Toronto, I think June 26. You're, you're part of Hotdocs.

Samantha Irby  35:13  
Not anymore. I'm coming in the fall because my wife just had a big surgery and has to be like, driven around. She has like a eight inch incision in her belly. So oh, but you guys probably use the metric system. I don't know what that is in centimeters. 

Mary Anne Ivison (Voiceover)  35:36  
15 centimeter. 

Samantha Irby  35:41  
Listen, I don't know, if you said XYZ centimeters. I'd be like, I don't know.

Wendy Mesley  35:46  
You'll have to give in eventually, Americans are the only ones left.

Samantha Irby  35:52  
I know. I wish we would just switch so I could get used to it. At this age. I'm like, I don't, learning new things.

Wendy Mesley  36:02  
It only takes about 20 years.

Samantha Irby  36:04  
I don't know. We better hurry up and change it. But I will be there. 

Maureen Holloway  36:10  
So hopefully we will see you in the fall. So we'll keep uh, well, we'll just keep us updated or your your your publisher will and we'll make this coincide, but in the meantime, what a pleasure it is to meet you, yeah.

Samantha Irby  36:24  
It was so great. Thank you so much. 

Wendy Mesley  36:26  
We love talking to you. Yeah, we love you. Yeah, it's a great books. So much fun.

Maureen Holloway  36:32  
And the book is called Quietly Hostile. 

Samantha Irby  36:34  
Yeah. 

Maureen Holloway  36:34  
And it's the latest from Samantha Irby and you can get it wherever you get your books. 

Samantha Irby  36:40  
Thank you. 

Maureen Holloway  36:41  
Thank you, Sam. Good luck with everything. 

So have fun.

Samantha Irby  36:45  
Oh, thank you. You guys are so amazing. This was so fun. Wendy and Moe, my new my new best Canadian friends. 

Maureen Holloway  36:56  
Oh, well great. I'm so glad.

Wendy Mesley  36:59  
We're besties in inches. I'm five foot six. So there's some things we still measure and the old system for some reason, I can't figure out what my actual height is, but there's seven centimeters somewhere.

Samantha Irby  37:13  
Now I can pick, I can picture it though. Because I know what five foot six is, but if you told it to me in centimeters, I'd be like very short, tall. 

Wendy Mesley  37:30  
Thank you, Sam. Are you okay with this calling you Sam. I know. It's kind of whenever you got into your dad and your mom and all that fun stuff. 

Samantha Irby  37:37  
Ya no Samantha is like, what the lawyer calls me. Everyone else can call me Sam, please.

Wendy Mesley  37:45  
I think we call you both so that's-

Samantha Irby  37:47  
Good I love it. I love it. 

Wendy Mesley  37:49  
So thank you.

Thank you, Sam. We're gonna trash you now. We're just gonna do a wrap up, but thank you so much yeah.

Samantha Irby  37:58  
Listen be sure to tell everybody that you could smell me for the screen. When you're trashing, when you're trashing me like, I didn't know you could make a recording smell like shit.

Maureen Holloway  38:21  
Are you five foot six?

Wendy Mesley  38:23  
I'm well, I used to be five foot six. I used to be five, five and three quarters, but I'm actually yeah, um, yeah, well, I don't know. Maybe I'm starting to shrink because I'm five-

Maureen Holloway  38:31  
Because I'm foot six and I think I'm five foot six. I used to be five foot seven and I think I'm a little taller than you and that's my takeaway from today's show.

Wendy Mesley  38:38  
I'm 5,6, 5,6, 5,6.

Maureen Holloway  38:42  
Are you you really okay, we're gonna have to do it back to back next time we see each other in person. We have a new best friend and Samantha Irby and I love her. She's hilarious and open and funny and and just everything you think that she's going to be more and we could have talked to her for twice the time. 

Wendy Mesley  38:59  
I know I've got a list of questions here. I wanted to talk to her but like her parents both died when she was 18.

Maureen Holloway  39:05  
I know, what doesn't kill you? 

Wendy Mesley  39:09  
Makes you funny. 

Maureen Holloway  39:11  
That's the lesson.

Wendy Mesley  39:12  
Yeah so she anyway, there are so many things like the parents dying and the advice for stuff that she wrote she wrote for shill shrill, to which she wrote about being fat. Like, and to me that's like, it's the it's the last frontier of discrimination, but she makes jokes about it which is great so apparently I'm a prude. But- 

Maureen Holloway  39:31  
Yeah you're a prude. 

Wendy Mesley  39:32  
But you just wrote about on Substack about not wanting to talk about money. So we're all prudes about different things.

Maureen Holloway  39:38  
Oh, well, money money was that's more of us, yeah, if that's my latest piece that's up on although by the time you're hearing this there, hopefully more and more but yeah, but there's that it's one of those things that makes everybody's you know bob tighten up talking about money because it's, it's a it's loaded, right. 

Well, I don't think people should talk about poo, but Samantha talks about poo all the time she gets into her TV shows and-

Yeah yeah she's yeah she's absolutely I mean she's hilariously funny her writing is fantastic and she does go where very few people will will go and just and but what really lovely and sweet and kind person well being hilariously funny good combo

Wendy Mesley  40:20  
Yeah super nice.

Mary Anne Ivison (Voiceover)  40:21  
The Women Of Ill Repute was written and produced by Maureen Holloway and Wendy Mesley With the help from the team at the Sound Off Media company and producer Jet Belgraver.